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It's a shame that one can NO longer trust the government for our health
Michael Ellenbogen
Posted: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 3:33 PM
Joined: 11/30/2011
Posts: 4016


I can not understand  why  COVID  has become  so controversial and political. I use to trust them and now one is left fending  for themselves.  Drugs that work to help you are removed from place that could save live.

PPeople who were our hero's  3 month ago have become our enemies and being  fired from there jobs.

PPeople who have both vaccines are still dying.  Any one can spread  the disease vaccineinated or non vaccineinated.  

II am just so sick of this as the more they mandate this  the less I will listen.  So many are being harmed  because of the government an the social media idiots.  I sure hop it changes as I am at a loss on what to do next.


Michael Ellenbogen
Posted: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 3:37 PM
Joined: 11/30/2011
Posts: 4016


II should ad a friend with dementia who had both shots ended up in the  hospital and got COVID and died. She was young and did it all right. Look way happened to Colon Powell. What a great loose.
Iris L.
Posted: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 5:06 PM
Joined: 12/15/2011
Posts: 17551


Michael, in the beginning I listened to daily Covid updates.  Now updates are often conflicting.  I don't watch television news.  I listen to radio news, which is in small snippets.  The medias want eyeballs and clicks--I don't give in to them, they thrive on fear and chaos.  I still handle myself the same way I did in 2020--mask, wash my hands and stay home.


A "friend" just called me on the telephone to blather on about politics.  I told her I only think positive thoughts and she hung up on me!  Ha ha!


Iris


jfkoc
Posted: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 10:39 AM
Joined: 12/4/2011
Posts: 20231


No one said that the vaccine totally protected you from getting Covid or that you could not die if you got it. 

The data is overshelming that the vaccine has been working. The chances of my becoming very ill, hospitalized or dying are drastically reduced. Still I wear a mask in every situation where I am near others. Vaccinated people are still shedders! Be careful

Regarding Colin Powell. He was a very sick man when he was exposed to  Covid. He was battling blood cancer and living with Parkinsons....extremely vulnerable.

I do not feel that I am fending for myself. I know that science is knowledge and that it changes. I am totally comfortable with that. So waiting for my Dr to say yea or nay on the baby aspirin.


EllisA
Posted: Wednesday, October 20, 2021 6:54 PM
Joined: 10/30/2020
Posts: 15


HI all.  I agree the loss of General Powell was tragic.  I too am fully vaccinated with the booster.  I am not as careful as I probably should b, but do practice 6' social distancing.  I am starting a walking program with walking sticks to help with balance.  Hopefully that will help slow this nonsense down.  I totally agree that the media is way out of control on the COVID issue.  Maybe they should shut up OR look on the bright side more often instead of sensationalizing the negative.  Sorry for the rant  EllisA
Jo C.
Posted: Thursday, October 21, 2021 10:03 PM
Joined: 12/9/2011
Posts: 12129


Michael, I am sorry this has become so upsetting for you.   I can understand why considering all the constant "noise" about the vaccines; especially from those who are either not based in science; from those who are ignorant and use the error driven internet communications for their only input, and those who are purposely using it for ratings or worse of the worst, for political purposes.  I completely stay away from listening to such dreck; no cooperation with their dysfunction from me.

NOTE:  As for Colin Powell; he had significant Multiple Myeloma for some time which is a cancer of the blood; treatment for that is chemotherapy; significant amounts of corticosteriods, radiation therapy and more depending on how far one wishes or is able to go with treatment . . . so he was already severely ill and due to the disease as well as treatment, he was truly and deeply devastatingly immunocompromised.   He also had Parkinson's Disease.  What we should also think about or wonder . . . . someone had to have given him COVID and what was the probability that it may well have been secondary to an unvaccinated person.  No way for us to know; just a question that popped up.

If you use Google to look at valid science based data sites, you will see that the number of people who are vaccinated and still get COVID is very, very low - and they usually do not end up in the hospital nor do they die.  

Michael; the vaccine does indeed work and it works well.  No vaccine is 100%; but the Pfizer and Moderna Vaccines are well into the 90th plus percent for prevention. 

So many individuals are fearful of the vaccine; some use totally false information found on the internet gabbing or from politicalized media or politically driven persons who are lying through their teeth or who are just plain ignorant and do not wish to be educated.

Many media outlets will ramp up their news presentations and excitedly present "ticklers" over and over and over again to get people to watch their news program in their perpetual wanting to be at the top of the ratings heap.  I do not fall for such idiocy.  

I do NOT overwatch the news and there is a channel that is vested in significant amounts of the worst of the worst false information and it is hurting people and even in their own way may be contributing to the deaths of people.  Should be criminal to continue to blab the false info when there is a pandemic wreaking havoc in our country, but it seems it isn't unlawful even though it is causing or contributing to tragedy for those not following the proven fact based science.

Try to not listen to too much news and for peace of mind it is best to stay away from the false reporters on the political end of the spectrum - they cannot upset you without your own cooperation by listening to them.  Your choice to be part of it or not.    I will catch the morning news to get the local weather and a bit of local news . . . then either in the morning or evening, I catch some of the national and international news from a credible news program.  Sometimes I watch a bit of British news which does not sensationalize on the channels available to us with our cable.  That's it - no one giving out the highly negative  false information gets one second of my time.  Period.

As for our front line workers quitting rather than getting vaccinated - that is a choice.  The hospital workers are a risk for putting the compromised patients at risk.  Not all hospital workers not getting vaccinated are nurses; some are aides and some are in non-direct patient care positions; even housekeepers. Quite a number have actually chosen to become vaccinated rather than to continue without doing so.

As for law enforcement; here is a fact for you:   Do you know what is the number one cause of death for police officers??  It wasn't shootings; it wasn't vehicle accidents; it was COVID - yes; that is the number one cause of death of police officers - COVID and none of them vaccinated; that is tragic as it is preventable.

Two of our sons are police officers; both are fully vaccinated and have had boosters. My husband is a retired law enforcement officer; he is fully vaccinated, and me as a retired RN am fully vaccinated and we will have our Moderna boosters as soon as they are available.  So each person in our family has done their own individual research and came in on the side of science.  I am grateful for that.  We continue to mask and to use distance; that is just common sense no matter one's vaccination status.

As for police officers quitting - well; I did notice that a number of them being dramatic were in  the older age category; they go out on retirement. Some are moving to different areas; some will do the "blue flu" bit, but many will end up coming back to their positions - the pay on the good departments in larger areas is pretty good; especially since there is not a college degree required for the job - they cannot go many places with a high school education and earn that level of income and benefits; they too have lives to live and to pay for; they also do not want to lose their years for retirement pension . . . . it will iron out in time.

Do not despair Michael; the vaccine really does protect and it is beyond sad how much unnecessary dissension there is over this - but as said, do not cooperate with the news that upsets you - let go of all the TV news noise that hammers at us looking for their ratings and just remember that the science has been proven not only in this country, but also internationally in huge, huge, millions of numbers of people.   I also do not argue with people who are of that uneducated and/or biased bent . . . . nothing will change their minds until they become ill; so I do not engage at all.

It will be okay if we keep ourselves on the calmer non-inflammatory side of the ledger and listen to the valid, credible sources in science and avoid all the "noise." 

J.


Michael Ellenbogen
Posted: Friday, October 22, 2021 9:24 AM
Joined: 11/30/2011
Posts: 4016


I know a top heart surgeon who refuse to get the shot for religiose reasons. He had already gotten covid and his blood was tested to show great immunity. Yet the place were he works gave him 30 days or he will be terminated. These folks no want to d and they are being treated like sh--. There are so many doctors and even Israel who I believe more than the US. I have two shots. I have been struggling on getting the booster and that is the problem for me at this time. My own wife who is a medical person is even question things now and that is unlike here. Something its seriously wrong with what is going on and I do not trust google or any other social media platform any more.  


Lane Simonian
Posted: Friday, October 22, 2021 2:53 PM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4998


I am unhappy about all of this, too.

I think in order to reduce vaccine hesitancy, the efficacy and safety of the vaccines was oversold.  Maybe the vaccines were highly effective before the delta variant, but became less effective at preventing hospitalizations and deaths after the arrival of delta variant.  In my county, they reported that 16 out of 100 deaths were in people who had been fully vaccinated.  The radio station dropped that statistic in later broadcasts.  In Oregon, in August 20 percent of all covid deaths were in people who had been fully vaccinated.  Most of the deaths (but not all of them) were in people older than 65 and/or were immuno- compromised.  But the same is also true of those who had not been vaccinated.

The idea that this was now only a pandemic of the unvaccinated was misplaced.  It was the exact wrong message to give during the arrival of the delta variant.  It made people think that they no longer had to take safety measures, that they were now invulnerable, and it was just a short amount of time before we reached herd immunity.

As yet, I have not seen any definitive data as to whether immunity provided by the vaccines is better or more long-lasting that natural immunity.  

All of the current vaccines have led to rare side effects such as myocarditis and blood clotting.  The number of deaths per 100 million first shots is around 200 in terms of blood clots.  A very small number, but not insignificant number.

The vaccines have saved many lives, but they are not perfect and much more effort should have been placed into identifying those individuals at greatest risks for severe and sometimes fatal side effects.

In addition for those at potential risk an option should have been given for regular testing in place of being forced to choose between their livelihood and possibly their life.