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Green Tea and carrots- Reverse Alzheimers
Djones2019
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 2:28 AM
Joined: 12/12/2018
Posts: 8


Green Tea and carrots can help reverse Alzheimers.
 
 Researchers from University of Southern California recently did a study examining
 epigallocatechin-3 gallate an ingredient in green tea and ferulic acid found in carrots, tomatoes, rice , oats and wheat.
 
 In a test completed on mice, after 3 months, mice that had a diet including both compounds
 completely restored spatial working memory.
 
 The researchers believe the study is promising because the study shows certain plant based
supplements help to protect against Alzheimers.
 
 Also: the release of catechins from loose tea leaves is significantly better from loose tea leaves than from tea bags. If the taste of green tea is too bland- experiment with other flavored drinks that can add flavor to the green tea such as cranberry juice or other type of juice. 
 
 Maybe try adding the green tea and carrots, tomatoes, rice, oat or wheat for a few weeks to see if there is an improvement. Other studies show coffee helps with Alzheimers. Green tea and matcha green tea are also in pill form.
BethL
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 8:37 AM
Joined: 3/25/2015
Posts: 535


I firmly believe that green tea is healthy. My grandmother drank plain old Lipton green tea, several cups per day, all her life. She lived to be 100.

As for the grains you mentioned, it's well known that rice contains arsenic, wheat in its present form (which is much different from wheat grown decades ago) causes a lot of digestive issues, and oats often (100% in a recent test) contain glycophosphate (Round up). 

My comments above do not address dementia; they address general health. I think the best we can do to attempt to stave off Alzheimer's is live a healthy lifestyle.


gubblebumm
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 9:09 AM
Joined: 7/12/2017
Posts: 1133


My mom was and still is a green tea drinking, eh, she still have ALZ and dementia.  So.....ps she ate healthy her whole life, I mean realllllly healthy, eh still got a brain disease, imagine!

romiha
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 10:45 AM
Joined: 12/21/2014
Posts: 486


My mom was born and raised in Japan, then moved to US when she married my dad some 62 years ago.  However, every day she drank green tea (loose leaves) and ate Japanese rice among other Japanese cuisine, until her Alzheimer's left her unable to figure out how to use her rice cooker and make tea.

I pesonally don't take much stock in hearing "green tea and carrots can reverse Alzheimer's", to be quite honest.  It's a matter of "your mileage may vary" - what works for some may not work for others and frankly I am skeptical of that actually working for others.

But, my dad is forever "falling" for these online scams (where he has to sit and listen to a 30-45 minute 'sales pitch') from these 'nutritional' sites, saying "big Pharma doesn't want you to know about xxx" and ends up paying a LOT of money for various snake oil and pills, in a desperate effort to get mom cured, because that's what these sales pitches are exactly designed to do ...

just my 2¢...


pidgeon92
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 12:20 PM
Joined: 10/25/2018
Posts: 239


I would really prefer if we could keep the snake oil treatments off this forum.
Mom's Baby
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 12:26 PM
Joined: 12/19/2011
Posts: 1133


How did they know the mice had cognitive impairments (e.g. Alzheimer's) before running this study? 

I have to doubt any study that says eating or drinking something will make brain cells magically regenerate. It's like saying drinking green tea will heal a broken leg or make an amputated arm grow back.  


EN85
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 1:21 PM
Joined: 1/10/2019
Posts: 64


I think that it is important to remember that a lot of people on here are looking for answers anywhere they can find them. I don't think that anyone is peddling snake oils on here but more so looking for feedback. Not everyone has been dealing with this disease as long as others. It's my opinion that we don't have to be so critical or judgmental of anyone's post. I thought we were here to help, encourage,share,motivate,vent, and be 100 about this disease. The disease is cruel but we don't have to be. If natural isn't your thing, then why comment at all. Yes, you have a right to, but think of the person that is in the beginning stages of this and just wants to try something, anything since the meds aren't working. I mean you may not have hope but don't take others away. I know that there is no hope for my mom, but I have hope for somebody else's be it with pharmaceutical or natural remedies. Somebody told me not to try coconut oil because it was a snake oil treatment and I almost quit the regimen because it came from a vet on here, but the first day I didn't, I felt like I wasn't doing all that I could do. Mind you no it's not a fix all but it has helped my mom tremendously. I notice the difference of when she has it Vs. when she doesn't. All im saying is let's support each other on here. Please don't rip me a new one about this post nor all the run on sentences. God Bless
pidgeon92
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 1:44 PM
Joined: 10/25/2018
Posts: 239


If a person has a real-life experience with something, and believes that it was helpful for themselves or a loved one, certainly they should share it.

When one username is regularly posting miracle cures, that's snake oil.
Lane Simonian
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 3:38 PM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4495


A few years ago, a poster with connections to Japan brought to my attention (and others) a product called Feru-guard: ferulic acid in rice bran oil and Angelica archangelica for dementia.  The initial studies were promising and it is now being tested in a large-scale trial through the Oregon Health and Science University.


 2011 Jul;11(3):309-14. doi: 10.1111/j.1447-0594.2010.00687.x. Epub 2011 Jan 28.

Effect of ferulic acid and Angelica archangelica extract on behavioral and psychological symptoms of dementia in frontotemporal lobar degeneration and dementia with Lewy bodies.

Abstract

AIM:

The behavioral and psychological symptoms of dementia place a heavy burden on caregivers. Antipsychotic drugs, though used to reduce the symptoms, frequently decrease patients' activities of daily living and reduce their quality of life. Recently, it was suggested that ferulic acid is an effective treatment for behavioral and psychological symptoms. We have also reported several patients with dementia with Lewy bodies showing good responses to ferulic acid and Angelica archangelica extract (Feru-guard). The present study investigated the efficacy of Feru-guard in the treatment of behavioral and psychological symptoms in frontotemporal lobar degeneration and dementia with Lewy bodies.

METHODS:

We designed a prospective, open-label trial of daily Feru-guard (3.0 g/day) lasting 4 weeks in 20 patients with frontotemporal lobar degeneration or dementia with Lewy bodies. Behavioral and psychological symptoms of dementia were assessed at baseline and 4 weeks after the start of treatment, using the Neuropsychiatric Inventory. The Neuropsychiatric Inventory scores were analyzed using the Wilcoxon rank sum test.

RESULTS:

Treatment with Feru-guard led to decreased scores on the Neuropsychiatric Inventory in 19 of 20 patients and significantly decreased the score overall. The treatment also led to significantly reduced subscale scores on the Neuropsychiatric Inventory ("delusions", "hallucinations", "agitation/aggression", "anxiety", "apathy/indifference", "irritability/lability" and "aberrant behavior"). There were no adverse effects or significant changes in physical findings or laboratory data.

CONCLUSION:

Feru-guard may be effective and valuable for treating the behavioral and psychological symptoms of dementia in frontotemporal lobar degeneration and dementia with Lewy bodies.

 

https://www.alzheimersanddementia.com/article/S1552-5260(10)01948-5/abstract

 

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ProvidedDocs/60/NCT03451760/Prot_SAP_000.pdf



gubblebumm
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 3:40 PM
Joined: 7/12/2017
Posts: 1133


I am all for natural, eating well and the rest of it, but from what I know about the brain, is once cells are gone, they are gone.  Other parts of the brain take over is how it works if I am not mistaken.  My problem with this is that people will go YES GReen Tea! Who needs medicines, research, tests, just drink tea!  Its all about public perceptions, financial needs, research, being taken seriously, that ALZ is NOT just memory and there is actually a whole family of dementias that need research and if drink tea, don't stress, have a carrot smoothie are advertised as a cure, then the rest of the nightmare diseases get pushed aside and we aren't taken seriously.

Its like saying to someone with type 1 diabetes, just eat better, you don't need insulin


Lane Simonian
Posted: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 4:29 PM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4495


I don't mean to ignore the relative merits or lack thereof of dietary approaches to the prevention or treatment of Alzheimer's disease, but I wanted to focus on one potentially important finding: brain cells probably can be regenerated in the hippocampus.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/04/180405223413.htm

It also seem possible that memories that were thought lost can potentially be retrieved.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2141677-lasers-reactivate-lost-memories-in-mice-with-alzheimers/

Some mice studies (which are not always reliable) suggest that certain types of memory are recoverable: spatial recognition and object recognition, for instance.  These are memories associated with the hippocampus.  Other types of memory in which other parts of the brain are involved (the frontal cortex, for example) such as memory of past events or the ability to put thoughts into some kind of logical order rarely show the same kind of improvement.  So may be the damage to certain parts of the brain is easier to repair than damage to other parts of the brain.

It is also possible that certain difficult behavioral aspects of dementia can also partially be reversed.  None of this simple and relatively little of it has been explored (and some times too much is promised), but some claims have to be given a serious look.


Victoria2020
Posted: Thursday, March 14, 2019 9:06 AM
Joined: 9/21/2017
Posts: 460


"How did they know the mice had cognitive impairments (e.g. Alzheimer's) before running this study?"  (Humor here).

They used a standard cheese wheel test -- cheddars - sharp, extra sharp, mild     

                                                                     soft- brie- imported vs domestic

                                                                    canned and cubed

Mice were then scored on which they could identify. Hard to understand them since they ate non-stop. And the orange dust from the cheese puffs got all over the test cages.

Fondues were offered to older mice with dental issues.

     


Lane Simonian
Posted: Thursday, March 14, 2019 10:12 AM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4495


For a second I got to laugh.

But now I have to go back to being serious.  There are two parts to this disease one is increasing oxidation and nitration in the brain.  The second is decreasing antioxidants in the brain.  Diets high in polyphenols (found in fruits, vegetables, green tea, rice bran, spices, etc.) such as a Mediterranean diet, a diet from India, or from China and Japan increase antioxidants in the brain.  They may delay the onset of Alzheimer's disease and slow its progression.

But just because you have a diet high in antioxidants does not mean it will offset forever triggers for oxidation.  You can do A, B, and C (eat a healthy diet, exercise, and not smoke) and still get Alzheimer's disease because of X, Y, and Z (environmental toxins, stress, and genetics).  

Here are a couple of examples.  Members of families with a presenilin 1 gene mutation that leads to early onset Alzheimer's disease develop Alzheimer's disease ten years early than members of families with the exact same gene in Japan (the Spanish carried the gene to both places in the sixteenth century).  The families in Colombia are exposed to some of the highest levels of mercury contamination in the world due to mining operations.  The families in Japan have a diet high in rice bran and drink green tea.  

Japanese American men in Hawaii have a higher incidence of dementia than those who live in Japan.  The main key is likely a difference in diet.

So many factors can lead to Alzheimer's disease that you cannot expect adherence to any factor that reduces the risk for the disease or avoidance of any factor that increases the risk for the disease to help you escape the disease for certain.  However, when antioxidants in the brain begin to be depleted as oxidation in the brain is increasing with age, you have to look for specific herbs, essential oils, etc. that help to put this imbalance back into some balance.



gubblebumm
Posted: Thursday, March 14, 2019 10:22 AM
Joined: 7/12/2017
Posts: 1133


My mom was a pioneer in healthy eating, protien shakes, smoothies, no junk food, ever, little processed food, lots of veggies and rice (we had rice for breakfast), stopped smoking at 25, exercised- swimming, running, power walking skiiing, etc.  She drank green tea forever. She started this path in the 60s, and she has been drinking green tea, taking her supplements all this time, so wow, yeah TEA, lets prescribe that instead of giving people help
Greg G
Posted: Friday, March 15, 2019 7:48 PM
Joined: 2/8/2017
Posts: 889


Mom's Baby wrote:

How did they know the mice had cognitive impairments (e.g. Alzheimer's) before running this study?   


MMSE!!!   :-0

Made you laugh!

Greg


selkirk60
Posted: Friday, March 15, 2019 10:59 PM
Joined: 1/11/2018
Posts: 77


Loved the fondue ...  good laugh.  I prefer a nice sharp white cheddar but the mice in my shed seem to prefer Milky Way candy and Cheetos. 

Actually, there are mice with genetic mutations that are are bred and sold for ALZ research.  Their mutations are ones that cause biological changes associated with ALZ.  I would assume some of the biological changes result in behavioral changes which are measurable.  There are a number of these JAX mouse models used in neurobehavioral and ALZ research. 

It's important to note that this study was about specific compounds found in green tea and carrots.....the mice were given these compounds, not the actual food.  The compounds were  probably given at higher concentration than found naturally in the foods.  So whether or not this study will prove to be meaningful has yet to be seen.   


Mike&BrendaTX
Posted: Friday, March 15, 2019 11:53 PM
Joined: 7/10/2017
Posts: 532


Just a caution.  Mice are often not-so-good as a model for humans (but they're cheap and easy to do research on).  Pharma companies have spent millions and millions over the past 10 years on things that worked really well in mice, but when the human trials were done, it didn't work on humans at all.  Just sayin'.

Mike


Lane Simonian
Posted: Saturday, March 16, 2019 10:37 AM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4495


The last two comments were quite good.

The problem with mice models is that you are giving mice amyloid rather than Alzheimer's disease and the two are not the same.  Some of the damage to the brain precedes amyloid and not all of the damage to the brain is caused by amyloid.  This is true even in cases of early onset Alzheimer's disease where mutations lead to the overproduction of amyloid.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-05722-9

If amyloid were the only cause of Alzheimer's disease than removing it early on would prevent and treat Alzheimer's disease.  Secondly if amyloid were the only cause of oxidative stress than almost any antioxidant (including compounds found in carrots and green tea) would prevent and treat the disease.  But to create a mice model that mirrored Alzheimer's disease you would have to have a mouse exposed to high levels of air pollutants, pesticides, chain-smoking, fed a diet high in salt, sugar, and carbohydrates, given medicines that increase cognitive decline, and exposed to various viruses and bacteria.  If you can reverse Alzheimer's disease in that kind of mouse you have a shot at doing it humans.

Amyloid oligomers (and I was wrong on this) were not necessarily the wrong target for treatment they were simply not the only target for treatment.  The problem was not that all the clinical trials targeting them started to late in the process.  The problem was that  these trials did not target what caused amyloid in the first place (oxidative stress) and did not target what amyloid oligomers and all the other triggers to Alzheimer's resulted in (oxidative stress).  That is why both mouse models and pharmaceutical companies targeting amyloid have led to what one journalist called the intellectual cul-de-sac of Alzheimer's disease treatment. 

One of the best animals models for Alzheimer's disease is canine cognitive dysfunction.  Here is one more thing we can learn from dogs.

 2002 Sep-Oct;23(5):809-18.

Brain aging in the canine: a diet enriched in antioxidants reduces cognitive dysfunction.

Abstract

Animal models that simulate various aspects of human brain aging are an essential step in the development of interventions to manage cognitive dysfunction in the elderly. Over the past several years we have been studying cognition and neuropathology in the aged-canine (dog). Like humans, canines naturally accumulate deposits of beta-amyloid (Abeta) in the brain with age. Further, canines and humans share the same Abeta sequence and also first show deposits of the longer Abeta1-42 species followed by the deposition of Abeta1-40. Aged canines like humans also show increased oxidative damage. As a function of age, canines show impaired learning and memory on tasks similar to those used in aged primates and humans. The extent of Abeta deposition correlates with the severity of cognitive dysfunction in canines. To test the hypothesis that a cascade of mechanisms centered on oxidative damage and Abeta results in cognitive dysfunction we have evaluated the cognitive effects of an antioxidant diet in aged canines. The diet resulted in a significant improvement in the ability of aged but not young animals to acquire progressively more difficult learning tasks (e.g. oddity discrimination learning). The canine represent a higher animal model to study the earliest declines in the cognitive continuum that includes age associated memory impairments (AAMI) and mild cognitive impairment (MCI) observed in human aging. Thus, studies in the canine model suggest that oxidative damage impairs cognitive function and that antioxidant treatment can result in significant improvements, supporting the need for further human studies.

Dogs are still not the perfect models as canine cognitive dysfunction follows along the lines of mild cognitive impairment, but you may at least improve some aspects of cognitive function and memory with the use of specific antioxidants in human beings even in the later stages of Alzheimer's disease (ability to recognize places and objects, for instance).


freemare
Posted: Wednesday, March 20, 2019 5:18 PM
Joined: 2/25/2015
Posts: 2


Yeah. You just never know. Each body is unique and what works for some doesn’t for others. I would imagine it would work at preventing getting it if one was going to get it as a result of lifetime build up of toxins but I wonder if someone is going to get it because it’s in their genetic makeup maybe then it doesn’t matter so much whether we eat healthy or not, just gonna get it no matter.  It’s an odd disease. I think my MIL has it from burying stressful traumatic things that happened in her adult life so much that it just did something to her mind. To our knowledge there’s no other person in her family that’s had Alzheimer’s or Dementia and many of her aunts, uncles and family have lived into their 80s and 90s with decent health. She is healthy too except she does very little in regards to exercise etc so she’s degenerating due to that but she’s healthier than I am at 57! She’s 75 although she’d tell you she’s in her 80s or 100s sometimes!!
freemare
Posted: Wednesday, March 20, 2019 5:36 PM
Joined: 2/25/2015
Posts: 2


I agree with you on some of that. We read that coconut oil cures it. Of course that means taking a large amount daily. Like four tablespoons (at least) or more. And not capsules. There’s a minuscule amount of good coconut oil in those. So it would be impossible to get her to take that much coconut oil daily!!  If it were me I’d do it. I love the stuff. But she turns her nose up to it. I read that Ashwagandha reverses it so we do give her that daily in capsule form. We buy a better brand but not too expensive and not too cheap. We give it to her every night and morning. She’s had very slow regression in the four years she’s lived with us. We wonder if that could be why?  I think if it’s possible something can cure it or at least shows that it has an effect on it then it’s worth trying especially if it’s something you can buy for yourself like green teas and carrots and some supplements and not something someone is selling that says it’s their product that holds the key to healing. Even if there’s good stuff in their product just the way they promote It is a turn off. Not to mention way over priced. It’s too bad they prey on the elderly like they do. They are so easily sucked in by it because they trust people. Back in their day, most people still had integrity and were honest. So they trust if these people are going to make such videos about a product then it must work! How far we’ve regressed as a society. Maybe you could get your dad to invest in those other (and much less expensive) options like green tea and Ashwagandha etc. They won’t hurt your mom and it’s not a big money loss if they don’t. Or maybe they’ll at least work to the point of slowing down the regression like I believe the Ashwagandha has done for my MIL.
Lane Simonian
Posted: Saturday, March 23, 2019 11:00 AM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4495


Welcome, freemare and thank you for your comments.  Ashwagandha and Bacopa monnieri may help slow down the progression of Alzheimer's disease.

Certain genetic mutations guarantee the onset of Alzheimer's disease, but other factors such as exposure to environmental toxins or a healthy diet may either lower or raise the age of onset.  My favorite example of this is that family members in Colombia with a presenilin-1 gene mutation develop Alzheimer's disease ten years earlier on average than family members with the exact same gene in Japan.  The Colombian families are exposed to some of the highest mercury levels in the world due to mining operations whereas the Japanese families drink lots of green tea and eat lots of rice.  

There is no way for any of us to absolutely prevent Alzheimer's disease and there is no cure for the disease, but there are likely ways to delay its onset and slow its progression (or perhaps even to largely stabilize it).


c111
Posted: Sunday, March 24, 2019 4:48 PM
Joined: 3/23/2019
Posts: 1


The Ferulic acid and EGCG study sees interesting.  Has anyone tested this approach?

I am considering trying it.  Where would one get 2 or 3 gram capsules of pure ferulic acid and EGCG.

Any ideas or thoughts.

Thanks

Clyde


Lane Simonian
Posted: Monday, March 25, 2019 10:54 PM
Joined: 12/12/2011
Posts: 4495


Hello, Clyde.  Maybe there are side effects that I am unaware of, but barring any I certainly think this combination is worth a try.  If you do try it, let us know how it works.  We need some answers.  Best wishes to you.
Wdyucubri
Posted: Wednesday, March 27, 2019 8:39 AM
Joined: 11/2/2018
Posts: 4


Hey.

I read about it. These products really help. Our doctor told my 60 year old grandmother that it is worth drinking a lot of green tea for disease prevention. Also, the doctor advised various products that improve blood circulation in the brain and allow to remove toxins from the body. He advised oriental diets like this https://askyourfitnessquestion.com/the-japanese-14-day-diet-plan-shopping-list-and-the-whole-diet-menu that just provide for the consumption of these and many other products. that can help people with alzheimer's


NatalieG
Posted: Wednesday, March 27, 2019 9:47 AM
Joined: 3/27/2019
Posts: 4


Re: Fondue.  LOL Good one!
NatalieG
Posted: Wednesday, March 27, 2019 9:54 AM
Joined: 3/27/2019
Posts: 4


"My mom was a pioneer in healthy eating, protien shakes, smoothies, no junk food, ever, little processed food, lots of veggies and rice (we had rice for breakfast), stopped smoking at 25, exercised- swimming, running, power walking skiiing, etc.  She drank green tea forever. She started this path in the 60s, and she has been drinking green tea, taking her supplements all this time, so wow, yeah TEA, lets prescribe that instead of giving people help"

"Stopped smoking at 25"? Smoking until the age of 25 could have caused significant damage to her brain....enough to counter all the good she is trying to do. The tea may be helping but not enough to overcome the damage your mother has already done.


Marta
Posted: Wednesday, March 27, 2019 10:04 AM
Joined: 6/3/2013
Posts: 665


Recent study at University of Kentucky found no link between smoking and dementia.
 
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